It is unprecedented: magistrates, lawyers and clerks are gathering this Wednesday, December 15 in front of the courts to demand means “worthy“for justice, three weeks after a forum denouncing suffering at work and a loss of meaning. A demonstration is announced at 11:30 am from Place Grenette in Grenoble.”It’s a historic movement“considers our guest this morning, Elsa Weil, magistrate in Grenoble and regional delegate of the Union Syndicale des Magistrates.
The government has already promised additional resources in recent months. What more do you hope for with this day?
The means are more important than usual, but they are still very largely insufficient and this is really what we want to show and in a very united way today. With not only, of course, magistrates, clerks, lawyers, but also the SPIP (Penitentiary Integration and Probation Services) and the PJJ (Judicial Youth Protection) who have agreed to join us. Because today, the demand is abysmal. Even if there are more resources, it is still insufficient in relation to the needs.
Let’s take stock of the gaps. You who are magistrate in Grenoble, what means are missing in our jurisdiction? How many magistrates would be needed?
So, in Grenoble, currently, there are 43 judges and 14 prosecutors for a population of 740,000 inhabitants. If we refer to the figures of the European Commission for the efficiency of justice, it would take 17.7 judges per 100,000 inhabitants. That is to say that we should in fact be, in Grenoble, 131 judges and 85 prosecutors to be able to really deliver quality justice.
And in Grenoble, how many cases do magistrates have to deal with? This is the consequence, I imagine. There are files in shambles.
I am a guardianship judge, particularly in the service of protected adults. We are three guardianship judges and six clerks, plus administrative officers. We currently have 8,500 cases to process, while the national average is 2,000 cases per guardianship judge.
So I imagine you don’t have time to deal with all of these files? How do you do ?
We have to take them but the problem is the deadlines imposed on litigants, which are always far too long and which make us lose a little sense of our profession. Because, when we meet people six or eight months after their request, we are a little off what they expected … And then with these delays, situations can get worse and we can arrive at a penal procedure. The judicial response also brings a certain civil peace, hence the need to respond on time when we are needed.
And I refer listeners to the large format of France Bleu Isère, where we actually spent 24 hours in this daily civil justice. The Minister of Justice is pleased with the means implemented and the justice budget (+ 8% for 2022). Eric Dupond-Moretti also explains that France now has 750 more magistrates than in 2007. Can the government really do more?
I think we can always do more. It is a question of will, a question of anticipation. Today, the difficulty also comes from the fact that we did not anticipate retirements at all. And even today, they are insufficiently anticipated. However, we know all this well in advance. Afterwards, the time for justice is not the time for our policies, we are part of something that goes beyond a five-year term. And that too is something that is essential for a democracy. You cannot live five years in five years because you need more time. And yes, more resources are needed. Of course more is needed.
There are also, I imagine, fundamental reforms beyond the means. A few years ago, there was the establishment of immediate appearances, the procedure of “pleading guilty in the French”, to accelerate the procedures. Should we go further?
So today, we are faced with a legislative stack which is quite destabilizing for everyone, which puts the entire profession in difficulty, from magistrates to clerks and lawyers, because there is legislative inflation that ‘we can no longer absorb. There is a stack of laws such that we no longer know which texts are applicable at the present time. In less than two years, we have had five very major reforms, particularly at the penal level, which do not follow in terms of the resources allocated.
There is currently, before the judge of freedom and detention, a reform on “restraint” – when a doctor decides to place a patient in restraint – we must intervene in a few hours. We will therefore have to mobilize judges very quickly. But that is done with constant means. We absolutely do not know how we will be able to respond to this legislative order. And everything is like that. Nothing is anticipated in terms of the number of people it takes to implement these reforms.
We hear your anger, which is shared by many. There are 17 unions and professional organizations that are mobilized today. Do you think this is a historic movement?
Yes, it is a historic movement because it is the first time that it affects so many people, including in courthouses. Another example: the Court of Cassation yesterday voted on a motion to relay these concerns of the magistrates. I think this is the first time in the history of the Court. She speaks all the same of “despair” of the profession, of “pauperization” of justice. These are extremely strong words, pronounced by senior magistrates, and which also recall the importance of Justice in democracy, in social peace. We are one of the pillars of democracy, it is essential today to remind people. There is no democracy without Justice, and this is also what we wish to recall today.
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