At the University of Würzburg, Jörg Hacker spent a long time researching bacterial pathogens. How the former RKI boss and Leopoldina president assesses the current pandemic.
When Professor Jörg Hacker said goodbye this February after a ten-year term as President of the National Academy Leopoldina, he was delighted: because in retirement he would finally find time to finish writing a book that he had begun long ago. The subject: infectious diseases. The scientist, who researched and taught at the University of Würzburg for many years, could hardly have suspected that it would become so topical. At the end of January, Hacker’s book will be published by CHBeck under the new title “Pandemics – Corona and the new global infectious diseases”. What’s new about infectious diseases? How dangerous are cholera, HIV, influenza or zika fever? And what consequence will SARS-CoV-2 have? A conversation with the microbiologist about the possibility of stopping pathogens.
Professor Hacker, as an infection biologist, which pathogen did you always face the most? don’t we say fear, but respect?
Prof. Jörg Hacker: As for the situation here in Central Europe, I have seen coronaviruses as a particular challenge for several years. There were two relatively small but dangerous events in 2003 and 2012, an epidemic from the SARS-CoV and another outbreak from the MERS coronavirus. Otherwise, Ebola has also drawn attention recently. And then of course influenza, you always have to keep that in mind. You have the feeling that with a new vaccine coming every year, it will work fine. But influenza and with it swine flu will keep recurring because these pathogens are so variable.
Keyword swine flu: you had to deal intensively with it yourself when you moved from Würzburg to Berlin in 2008 and became President of the Robert Koch Institute. Suddenly it was said: A newly mutated flu virus has jumped from pigs to humans.
Hacker: Those were unsettling hours at the beginning. We didn’t know anything. The virus was said to have appeared in Mexico and is spreading rapidly, including with deaths. Fortunately, however, it then became apparent that the symptoms were usually not as pronounced as initially assumed. The course of swine flu, or new flu as we called it, often turned out to be mild. But the virus always takes the first step. It can still get a lot more dangerous.
“Those were unsettling hours at the beginning.”
Prof. Jörg Hacker on the swine flu 2008–At that time you explained in a press conference what the new influenza virus was all about. Had to alarm without causing panic – when did you have your eye on Corona? When did you know it was going to be dramatic?
Hacker: At the beginning of the year you already noticed that this was something special and dangerous. It was quickly noticed by the public. It quickly became clear that this is a worldwide event that can be life-threatening and fatal.
–And what extent? Did you expect such a pandemic with all its limitations?
Hacker: Well, I couldn’t or didn’t want to imagine the extent. It is of course something special now, thanks to this strong internationalization and globalization.
Are you glad that you are no longer the RKI boss? That such a global pandemic didn’t happen during your time as President of the Robert Koch Institute?
Hacker: Let’s put it this way: You have to take it as it comes. I am of course often asked that. Even back then with the ?? new flu ?? the situation was already dangerous. At the beginning you didn’t know how the situation would develop. That changed with the development of a vaccine. In Germany we especially had problems increasing the acceptance of this vaccine. Because it quickly became apparent that there are many mild and asymptomatic cases, as is the case with Corona.
What was so surprising about Corona: Why the RKI hesitated so long in March and April to recommend wearing a mask.
Hacker: It’s right, it took a while for the role of the masks to be perceived in the way that makes sense. On the one hand, it is about the moment of protection, the medical side. But masks are also important as signals, as signs in public.
Virologists have become a very well-known professional group. Sometimes media star, sometimes enemy. How do you see this tension between science and politics, science and the public.
Hacker: Corona is an example of how important it is for science to find an ear. Compared to the situation five or ten years ago, it’s gotten better. The public sees that science is needed. Sure, the virologists are particularly challenged at the moment. But we are generally noticing that interest in scientists is increasing, worldwide. And we also see that science cannot easily be manipulated from the outside. I already have the feeling that politics is more receptive to what comes from science. That is good and right.
They are working on a new book, it will be ?? Pandemics ?? be called. What are ?? new ?? Pandemics? What distinguishes it from the old, well-known ones?
Hacker: They are mostly global in nature and they are developing very quickly. The spread of infectious diseases across countries and continents is a result of globalization, especially international air tourism. This was the case for a whole range of infectious diseases before the new coronavirus, such as the Zika fever or the new flu. You absolutely have to be careful that disease control on the one hand and sustainability on the other hand not become competitors. There are things that were previously not foreseeable.
What are you thinking of
Hacker: Due to global warming, certain carriers of infectious agents have evolved. In Germany, too, there are mosquitoes that transport viruses today. You have to see the epidemic systemically. It goes well beyond the acute measures we need to worry about.
–You just mentioned Zika. That disappeared from our public perception after the Olympic Games in Brazil. How is the situation?
Hacker: At Zika, it is of particular importance to us that attempts are made to genetically modify the vectors, i.e. the disease carriers. So to change genetically so that they no longer transport pathogens. That seems to work pretty well too. Zika viruses are transmitted by Aedes mosquitoes. You just have to see how it looks on the ecological side.
In your opinion, what have been the biggest, worst pandemics in human history so far?
Hacker: Certainly the plague in the Middle Ages, in the 14th century, which also had strong social consequences. Until then that certain sections of the population were made responsible for it. Then I would classify the Spanish flu of 1918/1919 under the very serious pandemics and epidemics. Cholera, too. Cholera continues to develop and appears again and again in connection with earthquakes or social events. What you also have to name: HIV. It’s good that it is now so treatable. But there is still no vaccine against the HI virus and this is often overlooked. And what one should now also include: antibiotic resistance. And Ebola.
Have bacteria or viruses actually played a bigger role in human history?
Hacker: Interesting question. I believe that the viruses have played and are playing a bigger role because they are more flexible overall in terms of their biology.
Where will SARS-CoV-2 be classified? What place will this pandemic get in epidemic history?
Hacker: You have to see that. It will certainly be the pandemic that will be the first to have a completely global character. And then a lot will depend on whether and when there will be a vaccine and a drug against it and how high the level of acceptance for it will be.
“It will certainly be the pandemic that will be the first to have a completely global character.”
Prof. Jörg Hacker on the importance of SARS-CoV-2 –What could have been learned from previous pandemics? What should we learn from this one?
Hacker: Pandemic plans are important! Above all, platforms are being developed for the exchange of information and also for scientific exchange. It is certainly important to focus more on science communication and to advance digitization more quickly.
Once again, the infection biologist Hacker asked: How dangerous is the corona virus compared to other pathogens?
Hacker: It is quite dangerous! One has to wait and see which mutations in the virus appear. The virus may turn out to be less disease-causing in a few weeks. But it can also get more dangerous. This is evolution under the microscope. You can almost watch something change. As an infection biologist, one is trained to be able to prove changes and to know that it is not a stable, but a very unstable process.
What will be the biggest consequence of the pandemic? What will be different after Corona?
Hacker: The fact that an infection penetrates into all areas of life, seen as a whole, will be remembered for a long time, including the AHA + L rules: distance, hygiene, breathing protection and ventilation will be with us for even longer.
Prof. Jörg Hinrich Hacker
The microbiologist, Born in 1952, grew up in Mecklenburg. Hacker studied biology in Halle (Saale) from 1970 to 1974, after receiving his doctorate in 1979 he went to the West. He completed his habilitation at the Institute for Microbiology at the University of Würzburg and was professor there from 1988. In 1993 Hacker took over the management of the Würzburg Institute for Molecular Infection Biology, where he researched and taught until 2008. From 2003 to 2009 he was Vice President of the German Research Foundation (DFG). In 2008 Hacker went to Berlin and became head of the Robert Koch Institute (RKI). In 2010 the microbiologist was elected President of the National Academy of Sciences and led the fortunes of the Leopoldina for two terms until spring 2020. His main areas of work were and are the molecular biological analysis of bacterial pathogens, studies of their spread and variability, and interactions with host cells.
Books by Jörg Hacker: “Pandemics – Corona and the new global infectious diseases”, CH Beck Wissen, approx. 128 pages, 9.95 euros. To be released January 27, 2021
“People, epidemics and microbes – infections and their pathogens”, CH Beck Wissen 2003, 128 pages, 8.95 euros.
nat
–
–
