I spent the first months and years with Chancellor Merkel as a rapporteur in Berlin, and especially at the beginning I remember how everyone underestimated her. The public, political rivals and the German media. Do you not feel that Mrs Merkel’s underestimation factor, especially at the beginning of the government, helped a lot?
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I think that’s the case and that he actually got to where he is in that way. The CDU could not agree on who should actually succeed Kohl and Schäubl. A lot of people thought that there would be only such a short-term patch and that they would do it without her. It was a bit of a secret how, at least in the beginning, it actually reached the top.
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Daniel Brössler (* 1969)
– Parliamentary correspondent for the German daily Süddeutsche Zeitung
– as a correspondent for the DPA news agency, he worked in Bratislava and Warsaw
– worked for the Süddeutsche Zeitung as a correspondent in Moscow or Brussels
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Looking back on those incredible 15 years in the Chancellor’s office, what new Angela Merkel has brought to German politics? Can she talk about a new style?
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I would say such a great pragmatism. He helped her as she considered the need to change positions, such as with regard to nuclear energy. It was simply that she came to the conclusion that a certain opinion was no longer sustainable, and she changed that policy. So I would say it’s pretty pragmatic. Also, more than they were used to with Kohl and Schröder, she managed to get her emotions under control. So it had certain qualities that we had not seen before with either Kohl or Schröder.
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That pragmatism probably surfaced the most after the Fukushima disaster, when the Chancellor, although a nuclear chemist by training, and I think an essentially convinced person about nuclear energy, said: When I see clear opposition from the German public, I will sign the Atomausstieg, resignation
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Exactly. In addition, I don’t think it has changed its mind about getting electricity from nuclear power. She knew beforehand that there was a risk. But she saw that the resistance of the German public had become a political fact that she suddenly had to reckon with. And faster than the politicians in her own party, she realized that there was no point in arguing about it for months or years. She made a quick decision. I would say that is a typical decision of Angela Merkel.
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It occurred to me that, at least until 2015, a large part of the German media was on hand, so that it often seemed exaggerated to me. Where did it come from?
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One factor is that the Chancellor is able to explain her intentions very well in a small circle of people. One of Angela Merkel’s biggest disadvantages in public perception is that she can’t explain her policy in a big forum, and she probably doesn’t feel like it at all. But in a smaller circle of people, Merkel is completely different. She is very convincing.
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This has always helped her a lot in Berlin’s political circles. She always found time to explain her motives to leading German journalists. She was really doing well. When you talk to those colleagues, they tell you that the Chancellor has really convinced them over the years that she knows what she wants and that these are sensible steps.
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Angela Merkel in good faith with Pope Francis.
Another factor is certainly the pragmatism that we have already talked about. Her policy simply does not copy any ideological beliefs. He always considers the individual arguments for a long time and then decides.
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But I wouldn’t say that the media always went so close to her. It was criticized precisely because it could not reasonably explain its policy to the general public. And that is the criticism we have seen since the refugee crisis. But it is true that she rarely faced really massive media criticism during her reign, as she did with Gerhard Schröder. So the last chancellor to have a really hard time with the media was Helmut Kohl.
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The crown princesses were not good enough
Related to this is another question that has always fascinated me that almost never, behind Angela Merkel’s back, was a clearly defined person from the CDU who would say: This is Crown Prince Merkel, this is the Crown Princess. This is most likely her successor.
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There were a couple of princesses. Von der Leyen was a princess, Kramp-Karrenbauer was a princess, but of course she is no more.
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Well, just that these ladies didn’t last long…
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Well, they didn’t last. Probably if Angela Merkel talked about it openly, she would probably say that the candidates in question were simply not good enough and they simply could not use the chance they had enough. But the fact is, it was hard for everyone and everyone to succeed next to her.
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But do I feel that Merkel somehow did not actively try to prevent anyone from endangering her?
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I don’t know, the Chancellor is a normal politician. In the early years, she made sure no one threatened her. It’s been a little different in recent years. The problem with who would come after her was suddenly here. I think it turned out that there were few suitable candidates who might have it.
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As for Mrs Kramp-Karrenbauer, who briefly sat in the chair of the CDU President, Angela Merkel is disappointed because she thought she had somewhat similar characteristics to her. And it turned out that Kramp-Karrenbauer was simply no Merkel. So the plan didn’t work out here. It is safe to say that the Chancellor does not want Friedrich Merz to become chairman of the CDU and then chancellor. And I don’t think that will happen either. But if it happened, it probably wouldn’t be what she wanted from Merkel’s point of view.
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When you mentioned the fiasco with Kramp-Karrenbauer, will the Chancellor still want to say anything about her successor?
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Certainly not. I think that would be completely atypical. She is of the opinion that she shouldn’t even say anything, that she had her time and that it’s not up to her now. But he certainly thinks his own. Maybe he’ll say it sometimes, but in the future. Even if she intervened in the process now, it probably wouldn’t help, because she no longer has the position, the role in the party. And she would actually only hurt her chancellor’s role. So – at least in public – he certainly won’t interfere.
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Angela Merkel’s critics have accused her of looking at the world with pink glasses from time to time.
Merkel understood that elections are decided at the political center
When one perceives the era of Angela Merkel from the Czech point of view, one is divided into the era before and after the refugee crisis. Is it the same in Germany?
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I don’t know if it’s just this division. For example, now the view of Merkel has changed a bit during the pandemic. Today’s Merkel, unlike Merkel a few years ago, knows that she does not have to go to another election campaign. I think it’s known, and now she’s the real Merkel, who, without fear of public opinion, is more or less doing what she thinks is right. And that’s what we’re seeing now during the pandemic.
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And it actually started a bit during the refugee crisis. I don’t know if she would have done that a few years ago. Hard to say. But I think she just thought: We can’t let that happen, those people are suffering, we have to be human. I don’t want to say that 10 years ago she didn’t think that one doesn’t have to be human. But the fact that she dared to pursue the policy is a bit of a manifestation of the Merkel, who no longer has to prove anything, and who will simply pursue the policy that she thinks is right. Of course, Angela Merkel went to the parliamentary elections once again. But she just didn’t have to prove who she is, what she can do, etc. to that extent.
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The big domestic political theme of Angela Merkel’s 15 years in the Chancellery building is the huge decline in the popularity of the SPD. I have a feeling that Mrs Merkel contributed to this, because she inconspicuously “challenged” social democratic issues. And she was also able to present the successes of the government as the successes of the CDU / CSU and she was able to blame all failures on the Social Democrats quite elegantly
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Well, I think the Social Democrats themselves contributed to this decline, but there is something to it. In my opinion, Merkel soon understood that the elections in Germany are decided in the political center. This is different from the aforementioned Friedrich Merz. And, of course, this terribly damaged the SPD, which had to decide whether to go further to the left. At the same time, however, the party also knew that political survival also depended on the political center for the SPD. And, of course, the success of the Grand Coalition government has always benefited the Chancellor and her CDU more.
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The price paid by the political system in Germany for Angela Merkel’s approach is both in the weakening of the SPD, but also in the existence and strength of the AfD. That focus on the political center meant and means that the CDU has lost support on the right side of the political scene. You just can’t have everything. But I think the Chancellor’s reasoning was right, because she gained more in the political center than she lost on the right side of the political scene.
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The SPD is, of course, in a difficult situation. But we can see the crisis of social democracy throughout Europe. So the problem is deeper than the fact that Angela Merkel is a bit of a social democratic Christian Democrat.
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Walking in the mountains, or a role behind the scenes?
I am also fascinated that in those 15 years, there has been no scandal, no affair, at Angela Merkel’s past or present. That the Chancellor was probably so careful that she didn’t forget some 100,000 marks in a drawer like Wolfgang Schäuble or whatever.
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I wouldn’t say she was careful. She didn’t have to, she just is. These are things that she is not interested in. And here she had a great advantage. I think it is simply not possible to corrupt Mrs Merkel. In fact, there lies a certain power of the Chancellor.
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Are there any signals of Angela Merkel’s career after her career as Chancellor? Will she just walk around her beloved mountains in northern Italy with her husband and eventually become a Frau Europa?
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I don’t think any big feature attracts Angela Merkel anymore. I think he’s even looking forward to having a little peace. But I don’t think she would get lost in the mountains somehow. In my opinion, she will continue to hear, but she will certainly not hold any official position, such as the President of the European Council or anything like that. But I can imagine that if she minds in international or even German politics, she will say so.
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What will German children learn sometime in 2050 about Angela Merkel and the years 2005-2020?
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I think it depends a bit on the outcome of the coronavirus pandemic. If it turns out quite well for Germany, it will probably be a little thanks to Mrs Merkel. To what extent will the refugee crisis still play a major role after x years? I dare say that. I’m a little worried that Angela Merkel will probably be remembered as Chancellor in pretty good times, and that it will probably be worse then.
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