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INTERVIEW. “Nothing justifies a debate leading to violence”

It is because he had shown caricatures of Muhammad during a class debate on freedom of expression that Samuel Paty, professor of history and geography in Conflans-Sainte-Honorine (Yvelines), was assassinated on Friday, October 16. For Joaquim Dolz-Mestre, professor of language teaching and teacher training at the University of Geneva (Switzerland),a democratic, republican school cannot accept that a social group, whatever it is, prevents it from debating ”.But organizing a class debate, a complicated exercise, requires keys. Explanations.

More than a third of French teachers say they have already self-censored. The debate seems increasingly difficult on issues as sensitive as history, religion, sexuality. Worrisome, right?

A democratic, republican school cannot accept that a social group, whatever it is, prevents it from debating. There is nothing that justifies a class debate leading to violence. Censorship, wherever it comes from, even on so-called sensitive subjects, is not acceptable. The debate makes it possible to develop “social capital”, in the sense that Pierre Bourdieu understands it. It allows students to defend a position, to support it with arguments, but also not to be manipulated.

How to do ?

We must first restore its nobility to the debate. Organize them regularly, and not necessarily on hot issues. We don’t do enough oral work in France. Dialogue is very important for the training of citizens. Like the German theorist Jürgen Habermas, I am in favor of an ethics of discussion, according to which we must hear everyone’s point of view, because that is what makes it possible to resolve social conflicts, while recalling here what is the framework: the laws of the Republic.

Not that easy…

Of course. Any debate must be surrounded by a minimum of precautions to avoid creating tensions, which prevent calm dialogue. We do not launch like that, without preparation in a debate on divorce, homosexuality, the referendum on the future of New Caledonia, colonization or secularism. On this last question, burning after the assassination of Samuel Paty, I think, for example, that things must be left to rest. Silence is not censorship. You just have to leave a little time.

Concretely, what are the rules for organizing a calm class debate?

The teacher must first plan things well. Select the documents he will show, contextualize the debate, recall the framework in which the discussion will be organized. Specify the rules of the game: the speaking time granted to each person, appoint a moderator. He must also anticipate obstacles, have a long lead on the possible reactions of one or the other so as not to be overwhelmed, which supposes to know the profile of each student.

What do you advise?

All the pupils must take turns playing the role of the moderator, the one who introduces the debate, asks the questions and reformulates the answers. First, it develops language skills. Then it forces you to self-moderate, to refocus, to no longer be in the affect on subjects that can be close to your heart.

Debating is also taking the stage, isn’t it?

Organizing debates requires a lot of respect and sensitivity. For my part, I often organize role plays. Recently, for example, we have heard about the controversial opening of a McDonald’s restaurant. One student played the manager, another a father, a third the representative of a consumer association, the last a doctor. Playing a role that is not the one that one would naturally hold requires to defend a position that is not one’s own. It is very interesting to understand the other, to play down a situation and to avoid, as is too often the case, to end up with physical violence.

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