They were both involved in the Dutch mission in Afghanistan. Henk Kamp as Minister of Defense in 2006, he was responsible for the Dutch deployment to Uruzgan. And Jaap de Hoop Scheffer, Minister of Foreign Affairs and then Secretary General of NATO. At the time, he advocated greater involvement of Western countries in Afghanistan. “How things are going is the last thing I imagined,” he says.
As Minister of Defense Henk Kamp visited Afghanistan about fourteen times. “We have been everywhere there. With the international coalition we have made an effort to help that country a little bit forward. It is terrible to see all those young people at the airport now. Not all young people know that, but the elderly know what the Taliban have wrought in that country. A true reign of terror, where women were only allowed on the streets under supervision and girls were not allowed to go to school.”
The Dutch plane that is supposed to pick up staff and interpreters is still not in Kabul. There are reports that planes are landing at the airport again. Kamp thinks the Dutch plane is at Manas airport in Kyrgyzstan, a country north of Afghanistan. The Ministry of Defense makes “no statements about operational details, also for security reasons”.
Misjudged?
German Defense Minister Maas admitted today that the situation is wrong estimated by the German government and its allies. “To be honest, I think that’s a bit exaggerated,” says De Hoop Scheffer. “The American services misjudged it, as did President Biden. In recent months there has been a reasonable degree of stability with about 2,500 military personnel. I do not share the conclusion that we have misjudged it.”
Both Kamp and De Hoop Scheffer are disappointed with how quickly the Afghan army has defected. “It is surprising that the Afghan army – trained at great expense – gave up the cities and districts without much fighting,” says De Hoop Scheffer. “You can give them tanks and helicopters, but loyalty and… commitment you can’t buy from the government. The cabal in Kabul was considered corrupt.”
According to Kamp, the Afghan army was four times as strong as the Taliban, but the soldiers have left, leaving their weapons and vehicles behind. “The Taliban have been able to prepare very well for what they have done now. And they have done that in Qatar. I think the international community should reflect on Qatar’s role.”
Nieuwsuur also spoke to an Afghan journalist and a lecturer at Kabul University about the situation in the city. “People are taking pictures with the Taliban.” Watch the video below.
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‘When I went out on the street, I was worried’
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It does not feel to former minister Kamp as if the misse has not achieved anything in the country, despite the rapid victory of the Taliban now. “In the areas we were responsible for, Uruzgan and Kunduz, we really contributed to stability and security over those 20 years. After the attacks in America on September 11, something had to be done. Al-Qaida has been driven out, the Taliban was chased away, we tried to get those 37 million people back there in decent conditions. But the outcome is very disappointing.”
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“I’m very scared of what’s going to happen,” says Kamp. “They are Islamic extremists who have provided a safe haven for terrorists for years. This country is once again becoming a source of misery in the world.”
Both gentlemen agree that really only the Americans could and can do something about it. But they don’t seem to want to burn their hands on the land. President Biden says not intending to “repeat the mistakes of the past”. He stressed that he “cannot let his troops fight endlessly in a civil war in another country. That is not what the American people want and deserve.”
But De Hoop Scheffer is not sure if Biden can sustain that. “It may be that Biden has to repeat. Obama left Iraq, then Islamic State came. Then a coalition had to come again to defeat it. I have no faith in Taliban 2.0. Nice videos in Kabul, because there are foreign But you don’t know what happens in the rest of the country. If it turns out that the Taliban are doing too little against al-Qaida and IS, I do not rule out that the Americans will have to take the lead again to enter militarily – and I hope they do, possibly with us. That’s the tragedy of Biden’s decision.”
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